From the start of 3 posts, 630 views, in a couple of hours, we have a winner guys!!! topicsucks welcome
shocked
I think any one having these impure thoughts should give me all their spiders and leave the hobby, deal? stir
Ok, so who wants my spiders in that case? I shall be stepping out of the hobby! sad whistle2


I don't think it is as easy to do as it has been said in this thread.
I have my doubts, I think some spiders will be harder than others and some spiders wont even bother to drop.
I think any male will mate with a female regardless the colour, the size or the vertical stance, that is what they are there for, a dance, insert and maybe dinner. :laugh:
I think there is allot that we don't know about our spiders and the females reproductive origins and the males for that matter.

What I have read and been told is that hybrids will be sterile, which means they will not be able to breed. so it will be the end of them when they reach maturity. But
Can't really say that,if you have to look at the Avics and the Lasidora species.
But these 2 species practically comes from the same area.
Is that a clue there? Does that mean something?

How do we know that the sperm is the right sperm and it will work like it should?
That got to do with genes and DNA and things like that.
How do we know that the spermatheca in the females is the right shape to hold the sperm?
How do we know the spiders from the hybrid sack are going to be fertile, with the regards to breeding?
How do we know the eggs are going to be fertile, the female might just drop a phantom sack!?
How do we know if the males bulb's are the right shape and size to insert into the females?

We talking about hybrids like they will becoming out of the wood work at any moment! whistle2

I'm sure their are people who have done and are tiring the hybrid thing.
I'm sure they will not put there names on this thread as it might just make it turn into boxing match if we know it is really happening. uzi noob

I am in two mind frames regarding this thread, the curious person in me would love to see what the out come is regarding hybirding, but on the other hand the thought of killing so many T's to ensure that they don't get into the wrong hands and be sold as pure breds or create havoc, is very sad to know.

I also believe once you start with this you need to see it through until the very end, as you are responsible for what you have created, and I have see how easy it is to lose interest in something that have been started.

The possibility of the hybird being sterile is great, but what if they can reproduce, it will indeed be interesting to see if a new breed is created, I think DNA testing is a great idea, but how far is NatCom really prepared to go to see this through, as there was mentioned DNA testing is expensive, and there was a question asked that was not answered, will these males need to be alive or frozen for DNA testing?

We can also learn so much more regarding our tarantula's and even other spider species, but then how far are you really willing to go, and when do you reach the point of saying up to here and no more.

As I see it Dave has much to gain and lose from this, it is a 50/50 from start to finish, it is not something I will do personally, but
I would like to see the outcome from start to finish, and what we can learn from this. So I will wish Dave good luck in taking this on and looking forward to see his findings in this. :thumbsup:

For Hybridizing project to really work, it doesnt take a one male and one female to get the results you
really wish for.

If i was to dedicate my time into such projects, the assets to make the projects a success will
have to rely on space, time and money. You need, for example i wanted to hybridize T. Blondi
and T. Apophysis, i would need a minimum of 5 females of Blondi/Apophysis and 2 males.
Then your chances are there.

The Hybrids im talking about, is that should i have a Apophysis female that is freshly molted
and have a mature male Stirmi that is tapping and still making sperm webs, the interest will be there
to see the outcome, if there is success( which i doubt) but the results would be something that
would have to be investigated into the Spermatheca shape and dynamics as the female
was able to take in the sperm and produce viable offspring. DNA testing would be something to
consider aswell.


As for the others that are so against the hybridizing, I understand your concern as you are passionate about your
hobby as i am extremely passionate about my hobby, but pull your head out your arse, seriously. Don't play the all
innocent card that you have done nothing wrong in your life. Iv seen a few thread on Archnoboards and other forums
where hybridizing has been a success,and instead of the breeder getting shunted, they got praise as they raise
questions and provide more depth into the hobby.( not directed at anyway in specific, so dont get angry Panama)

Half the time the off spring is so weak that they end up dying easily. My Stirmi/Blondi hybrid died from a
wet molt, and it was only a juvie.

Anyway, why would i want to breed hybrids anyway when i want to breed pure breeds, after all, im only
in this hobby to make money :angel:

Dave wrote: Anyway, why would i want to breed hybrids anyway when i want to breed pure breeds, after all, im only
in this hobby to make money :angel:

:igiveup:
:igiveup:
:igiveup:

I'm not saying breed pure specimens to make money Dave...
I'm saying breed pure specimens to create a more abundant amount of such a lovely rare T for the rest of the hobbyists to enjoy.
It's very simple in my opinion.

I'm just going to stay out of this thread from now.

The term "common sense" should be changed to "rare sense".

topicsucks

enjoy.

Panama wrote:

Dave wrote: Anyway, why would i want to breed hybrids anyway when i want to breed pure breeds, after all, im only
in this hobby to make money :angel:

:igiveup:
:igiveup:
:igiveup:

I'm not saying breed pure specimens to make money Dave...
I'm saying breed pure specimens to create a more abundant amount of such a lovely rare T for the rest of the hobbyists to enjoy.
It's very simple in my opinion.

I'm just going to stay out of this thread from now.

The term "common sense" should be changed to "rare sense".

topicsucks

enjoy.

That was pure sarcasm but common or rare sense doesnt see that, i was referring to other members that come in with a bang, breed like crazy, make money and leave. I can tell you now, i breed Stirmis, and i kept all the babies, because i love them that much.
And if i get blondi and apophysis or my other two stirmi babies drop, ill probably keep alot of them aswell, as i dont want my
babies to get in the hands of other morons in the hobby. But my close friends will get my offspring( should i
be lucky enough) welcome

Nice to see that we can have a semi-civil debate once in a while Panama, I can understand why you are so against it, but shouldn't we all keep a open mind? I've met people who hate hybrids and yet they owned a Wolf Hound (Canis familiaris x Canis something). I can understand why you would get angry or whatever with my comment regarding euthanising the remaining offspring should I leave the hobby, but just think, how many south africans hate hybrids? Who would take them or buy them? It's unlikely I would ever leave the hobby entirely, especially not with hybrids, but I would destroy them if it would protect the hobby. However, I would probably rather just keep the hybrids than leave the hobby entirely as I would have a responsibility to protect the hobby.

Phew, that took a few re-writes to word properly and I'm not entirely satisfied with it.